|"In the material world, 'This is pāpa, this is puṇya'—this is mental concoction. Everything is pāpa. Dvaite bhadrābhadra sakali samāna. The world of duality, material world, we have manufactured something, 'This is good; this is bad', 'This is moral; this is immoral'. But Caitanya-caritāmṛta author said, 'These are all mental concoction. Everything is the same—material'. Material means bad. But we have made some convention: 'This is good; this is bad'."